Curse

Defender Of Orth · Jan 30, 2006, 11:13 PM // 23:13

Well, The way I make money with my warrior is, runs in the desert. I run for tips. Well... I dont mind small amounts (100 gp or so) but once we get there and the entire team just leaves and puts me on ignore, well....that pushes my buttons

.

So, I was thinking that A- net could install somthing like

Player "Nubpatty" Will give player "ME

" 150 gp once the team reaches the area "Dunes Of Despair", so basicly, you put up what you give to a certain person once you reach that location, also, you would know what they offer because it would show you if it was towards you.

Kinda hard to understand, but If you can, please reply!

Plague · Jan 30, 2006, 11:43 PM // 23:43

I don't think they look too favorably on runs to begin with, considering how often they rape income means via running. Why they even added running skills I don't know.

I've actually been on a tip run with my necro in which the runner accused everyone that didn't pay right off the bat on an easy run of being cheap, even ridiculing others of being cheapskates when they paid 500 gold, bragging on how she usually made 2k from each person. I was attempting to trade with her while she was complaining, and was about to give her 2k before she started complaining. She got 700 gold.

PieXags · Jan 30, 2006, 11:48 PM // 23:48

No, I don't think this should be added into the game. When you say you're running for tips people assume you don't mind doing it for free, and that you wouldn't mind the OCCASIONAL couple hundred gold from someone. If you expect to get paid, say "Running to Dunes of Despair for 500g" or whatever the ammount might be. Or if you don't want to set an amount, ASK people before you leave whether or not they intend to pay you anything. Otherwise they can only assume it's alright for them to not pay up. You are entirely in control over how much you get payed for your "services", there's no reason to add something like this simply because people don't tip how you want.

Defender Of Orth · Jan 30, 2006, 11:54 PM // 23:54

I just expect somthing, but my last three groups just left as soon as we got there, I dont mind little money, but none is D:!

Vilaptca · Jan 31, 2006, 12:11 AM // 00:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by PieXags

No, I don't think this should be added into the game. When you say you're running for tips people assume you don't mind doing it for free, and that you wouldn't mind the OCCASIONAL couple hundred gold from someone. If you expect to get paid, say "Running to Dunes of Despair for 500g" or whatever the ammount might be. Or if you don't want to set an amount, ASK people before you leave whether or not they intend to pay you anything. Otherwise they can only assume it's alright for them to not pay up. You are entirely in control over how much you get payed for your "services", there's no reason to add something like this simply because people don't tip how you want.

This is what everyone thinks, and I have seen a few runners come on the forums with the same complaint you have. They think tip means one thing, but everyone else thinks it means another. You may have to start being more specific if you are going to have a problem with this.

Just like tiping at a restaurant, sometimes you give one, if they are nice and curteous and you aren't a jerk, sometimes you don't if the server is rude and not very helpful.

Nevin · Jan 31, 2006, 12:32 AM // 00:32

Running isn't an official activity for guild wars, its created by the players..

Personally I do forge running on my warrior, out of the 140+ people I've ran I've only been scammed by about 12, and D/Ced by about 16 (But I don't consider D/C scamming) As for the most part I find players to be pretty honest.

Edit: Don't charge for tips if you want money.

Guardian of the Light · Jan 31, 2006, 01:14 AM // 01:14

Dude Anet isn't a fan of running or farming so there is an almost 0% chance that they'll put something in the game to help them (on perpose).

Ristaron · Jan 31, 2006, 01:15 AM // 01:15

ANet will never endorse taxi services, and therefore you shall never, ever have guarantees that your get-rich-quick scheme to ultimately drive up inflation will work. So please, give up, and focus on running your guildmates places.
Or do you charge them too?

Toffin · Jan 31, 2006, 01:29 AM // 01:29

Yeah it sucks when you get scammed, I as a runner even know that someone can scam me. Dont take at heart you will make the money back by charging a little more next time. I dont think there should be anything of the sort for runners. I have had people run missions asking for a piece of armor to hold to make sure you pay.

Defender Of Orth · Jan 31, 2006, 11:31 AM // 11:31

I dont think there honest, and charging a full price wont help, they can still just leave once I get there.

(I dont charge guildies =/)

Nevin · Jan 31, 2006, 12:14 PM // 12:14

Look at being scammed as redemption for our fast making money with minimal work.

Out of complete honesty (And no means of boasting), After about 10 runs to Droknars, it really isn't that hard you know it by heart. It was quite simply 10k every half hour for me (Average time it'd take me to do a run) 2k per person, 5 people.

Pro-Monk · Jan 31, 2006, 12:41 PM // 12:41

It pays to remember that any player requested changes to the game takes up resources at ANET that will either put more load on the servers (more lag) or take away from development of overall improvements.

Since the issue of runners and those being ran scamming one another has been around since the beginning of the game, it's highly unlikely there will be anything done about it. That doesn't even take into account the larger issue of running in general, which a lot of players think should be nerfed out of existence.

Runners not getting paid, and those being ran getting scammed by runners, is just part of the running game. If it bothers you that much, you should find another way of making coin.

cagan · Jan 31, 2006, 01:30 PM // 13:30

Anet have said of varying occasions that they are perfectly fine with runners. I don't know where some of you are getting the notion that they are opposed to it.
Yeh, a few run spots have been tweaked over time, which only implies that they don't want it to be too easy in some spots, not that they are opposed to it.
They seem to be all for player run money making ventures in general. (except gambling, or anything else that might be actually illegal)

They have also said how opposed to scammers they are of course punishing offenders on a regular basis, so, while i don't think we should assume that making running 'fairer' is necessarily a big priority of Anets, we can assume that minimizing scammers and cheats is quite up there.

What i'd like to see, which i think may be like what the OP is mentioning, is something like, before the trip, the runner clicks somewhere that his destination is XXX, and the price is XXX. Then, before leaving, each person agrees to the amount, and the cash disappears from there characters and is essentially held somewhere by the game.
As soon as the runner reaches the destination, the funds are automatically given to him, if he fails, or the player leaves the party before the destination .. the funds are returned.

Probably complicated, probably not going to happen .. but something that would be nice nonetheless.

konohamaru heaven · Jan 31, 2006, 04:15 PM // 16:15

I whole heartyly agree with the OP for being annoyed, but at the same time there is a chance you wont get anything for running for tips its a double edge sword. I know when I get ran for tips I tend to pay more than the average price just to be polite ^^, but for the post part most people will tip you if you do a good job and are polite.

~Konohamaru

Defender Of Orth · Jan 31, 2006, 08:47 PM // 20:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by cagan

Anet have said of varying occasions that they are perfectly fine with runners. I don't know where some of you are getting the notion that they are opposed to it.
Yeh, a few run spots have been tweaked over time, which only implies that they don't want it to be too easy in some spots, not that they are opposed to it.
They seem to be all for player run money making ventures in general. (except gambling, or anything else that might be actually illegal)

They have also said how opposed to scammers they are of course punishing offenders on a regular basis, so, while i don't think we should assume that making running 'fairer' is necessarily a big priority of Anets, we can assume that minimizing scammers and cheats is quite up there.

What i'd like to see, which i think may be like what the OP is mentioning, is something like, before the trip, the runner clicks somewhere that his destination is XXX, and the price is XXX. Then, before leaving, each person agrees to the amount, and the cash disappears from there characters and is essentially held somewhere by the game.
As soon as the runner reaches the destination, the funds are automatically given to him, if he fails, or the player leaves the party before the destination .. the funds are returned.

Probably complicated, probably not going to happen .. but something that would be nice nonetheless.

Thats what I was trying to say!

EternalTempest · Jan 31, 2006, 09:00 PM // 21:00

/Not Signed

Runners can be scammed, People being run can be scammed. Pretty much this game is like the wild west, anything extreme they will actually do something.

One of the reason's why this game doesn't cost any money is no internal GM (staff) support the players against scams, internal abuse etc. But I don't see anet going the other way (or need to) to set up a running system / token aka anti don't pay me system.

Agree that Anet has nothing against runners and nor do I. Only problem I have is running to be "uber" in the Drak/Asc Arenea but that is different topic.

And to you runners that run of tips, I do thank you greatly

(Now I tip what I can afford, if I have 100 gold, I will pay 20-50, if I have 3-4 plat I am far more generous depending on the runner). I've been to Drak early to get armor and resumed twice now one for tips / test run, the other for free -refused tips.

thor hammerbane · Jan 31, 2006, 09:18 PM // 21:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plague

Why they even added running skills I don't know.

So some noob monk in pvp doesnt run around Fort Koga for 10 minutes while my team gets slaughtered, and then in turn i am slaughtered.

Alicia of IGE · Jan 31, 2006, 09:45 PM // 21:45

Please allow me to point out some thoughts being ignored by the pro/anti running crowd:

For those of you that don't know, "grinding" to level 20 is merely a tutorial, IMHO, to learn the game mechanics. For your 3rd or 4th characters, if you chose to play them in PVE, do you honestly want to go through the same storyline again? Just because some of you may be so in love with the content provided by GW to the point you want to repeat the experience over and over again, not everyone have the time that you have and just want to get to the higher level content for whatever reason. For example, SF green farming = somewhat fun. Going to Ascalon Settlement with Cynn and company for the umpteenth time, = not fun!

I've ran many nice people who's only goal was to:

a) not waste money on intermediate armor when they can just buy the final armor they want. Why waste time and effort to get armor that can only be salvaged into materials you wont ever need again?

b) level up so they can play the game they want, be it UW farming, PvP w/PvE character, or just hang out in Marhan's Grotto. That's how they chose to play their game, just as you chose to see Rurik die for the tenth time and still hope that maybe somehow he dug himself out of the avalanche just in your instance and Ascalon history was changed forever? We can respect everyone's choice. By limiting our options, we are only limiting our freedom to play the game the way we want to play.

c) to be frank, an experienced player can have the entire map opened up and leveled to 20 in about a day. For those of us that have already gone through the grind, why put up with random pugs and people that really just don't know how to play the game which is why they toil in the lower level content in the first place?

For those that get runs to get an unfair advantage in newbie arenas, shame on them, but at least you know it doesn't last forever. They will level with experience where they have no choice but to move on. So you were griefed for one free PvP session. Suck it up. That's what you tell us reputable runners that are willing to believe in the human kindness and accept payment for our skilled labor at the end of the service only to see people leave the party and put you on ignore. At least you have some recourse. All we can do is make sure not to run that invidual again if that's even possible (Anet, can we have a bigger ignore list?)

Advice for tip runners: by tip it does imply what people feel like paying you. If that feeling is 0, that is what you get. if you don't value your time and skill, by all means run for tips. But to complain about it does seem silly. There are many mechanisms to which you can guarantee payment. Practice them and you will be rewarded for your time. And while I agree, good people definitely outnumber bad people, it's that 10% of bad members of the community that makes it seem like they are everywhere. By allowing yourself to be scammed, you are only encouraging that bad behavior. If someone cant agree to your terms, don't run them. There will be someone that appreciate your service and it is those people that you want to cater to, not the scammers. Just remember, difficult people at the beginning the run before you started will not magically turn into not difficult people by the end of the run. Don't waste your time and efforts with them.

geminisaga · Jan 31, 2006, 10:39 PM // 22:39

do elona run, less scam pay at last shard :P

TehTomato · Jan 31, 2006, 10:44 PM // 22:44

Sometimes if I don't plan on paying well I just tell the person before hand that I plan on stiffing them, and they're nice about it. Ussually...